tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post6115988063704566064..comments2024-01-06T06:09:29.140-05:00Comments on An Urban Teacher's Education: E4E: Educators Sans Contextjames boutinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09625944306253098621noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-47826013564752793642012-12-14T18:36:13.069-05:002012-12-14T18:36:13.069-05:00Pretty component of content. I just stumbled upon ...Pretty component of content. I just stumbled upon <br />your site and in accession capital to assert that I acquire actually enjoyed account your weblog posts.<br />Any way I'll be subscribing on your feeds or even I achievement you get right of entry to consistently fast.<br /><i>My website</i> : <b><a href="http://www.yourtobaccosstore.com/5-samson" rel="nofollow">samson tobacco</a></b>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-82381530611195445352011-08-09T01:39:10.502-04:002011-08-09T01:39:10.502-04:002 years of teaching does not make you an expert in...2 years of teaching does not make you an expert in Teaching or the Educational Field. I can understand their viewpoint, but don't believe they are well informed or experienced, just like cathie black.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-35267265499510518652011-05-13T18:01:57.730-04:002011-05-13T18:01:57.730-04:00Anon @ 355: Thanks so much for actually clicking o...Anon @ 355: Thanks so much for actually clicking on the links and reading them. I think that's rare. <br /><br />I guess I should have been more clear in my post. E4E's website says there is no factor more important to a student's education than the quality of teacher instruction. As you point out, all of the studies I linked say that teachers are the most important IN-SCHOOL factor. The "in-school" part is very important, and not included by coincidence or for aural aesthetics. It indicative of the reality that outside factors may have a larger role to play on student achievement than the teacher. <br /><br />Thanks again for reading and thinking.james boutinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09625944306253098621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-68717078359463843602011-05-13T15:55:44.019-04:002011-05-13T15:55:44.019-04:00I just wanted to point out that one of the links y...I just wanted to point out that one of the links you posted to refute the idea that "there is no factor more important to student success than the quality of our instruction" actually says that "Educational research continues to give us clear and convincing proof that the single most powerful in-school factor for student achievement gains is the quality of the teacher." Perhaps do a quick check before posting your links? ...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-23720320007664859802011-04-21T14:57:41.156-04:002011-04-21T14:57:41.156-04:00These guys have an office!!!-Funded!!!-24 and 25 y...These guys have an office!!!-Funded!!!-24 and 25 years old!!!!-taught for no more than 3 years!!!! Maybe the Gates foundation can fund me!!! Who do their fathers know??Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-67837568610239346562011-02-10T10:33:43.903-05:002011-02-10T10:33:43.903-05:00RE,
Why does one need any kind of evaluation othe...RE,<br /><br />Why does one need any kind of evaluation other than constructive criticism if not as a tool for firing? Perhaps I just see formal evaluations as a waste for all involved. The reason that districts seem to want to revamp evaluations, though, is to make it easier to dismiss teachers or as a basis for differentiated pay. Unions aren't doing their job if they don't oppose both of these items.<br /><br />As far as managers go, my original point stands - get rid of crappy managers and get good ones, regardless of their backgrounds.<br /><br />I shouldn't have used the word "private" when describing the money issue. I'm not at all a fan of for-profit schooling, but I don't mind charters if they work. In principle, a charter school could just mean a decentralization of the current system in larger districts. I'm afraid the snake-oil salesmen and for-profit support companies are already entrenched in public schools. (I'm not sure, though, that they work much more poorly or cost much less than some of the public support agencies, at least around my area.)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-20159409891012071672011-02-01T18:39:56.786-05:002011-02-01T18:39:56.786-05:00abellia - I think we can all agree that cool websi...abellia - I think we can all agree that cool websites are a major part of the solution. Where we would probably disagree is over where the problems in the system are. It sounds like you understand education to exist in more of a vacuum than it does. A school's poor performance on a set of standardized test scores can be caused by an enormous number of factors, of which "educators" are merely one. <br /><br />I don't think lacking classroom experience would be as disastrous for an administrator if we didn't have the current fire-all-the-teachers climate that we do. The people going into administrative positions (especially in big cities) are often the kinds of people who will do anything to get ahead. They ride teachers about trendy ed jargon they heard at a conference they just went to, but have no idea how to implement in reality. They focus on test scores in a way that seriously harms education. They treat people like trash and cause high rates of teacher turnover. They think test scores can be treated like profit. They're wrong on all accounts, and the effects they have on schools are disastrous. <br /><br />Can you tell me why you think the teacher evaluation nightmare is mostly a result of the unions.<br /><br />And, I do care whether the money is public or private - but I think I explained why pretty well in my post.<br /><br />Glad to have you commenting.james boutinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09625944306253098621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-72215438729760844012011-01-31T12:32:14.904-05:002011-01-31T12:32:14.904-05:00It sounds like you are more concerned about the we...It sounds like you are more concerned about the well-being of the heretofore public school system than the students. Not that this is the case, but that is how it sounds.<br /><br />You speak of dollars going to public employees - I personally don't care who pays the salary of teachers, as long as they do a decent job.<br /><br />You worry about unqualified teachers in charters (but not in other schools) while you pretty much admit that there isn't a good way to formally evaluate teachers. The statistics (test-based, of course) don't support the assertion that charters, as a whole, are any better or worse than their non-charter counterparts. The statistics supporting certification as beneficial are also very weak.<br /><br />You lament using student test scores as a criteria for teacher evaluation. I do too. But the entire teacher evaluation nightmare is (mostly) a result of the union protections, which may be valuable to employees, but they don't do much for students if they have a crappy teacher (by any measure).<br /><br />I'm not sure why anyone buys into the pay for performance thing. We're not picking grapefruit here.<br /><br />You complain of corporate managers, but it isn't the fact that they don't have classroom experience that you cite, it's that they are doing a crappy job. There are plenty of crappy managers who came up through the education ranks too. You know at least few, I'm sure.<br /><br />What comes across here is something like: let the educators take care of this and all you reformer-people go home. But you have to look at the perception of why the reform movement is necessary at all - that the "educators" have failed, so somebody else better come in and fix things. There is a legitimate concern here that needs to be taken into consideration. Too much blame is always placed on the schools and teachers (and credit in the case of some successes), but there certainly is room for improvement.<br /><br />Maybe Michelle Rhee is a pompous and egotistical manager, but she is perceived as having changed things that needed changing. If teachers want to be heard over the Ed-reformers, they have to admit that they have problems and come up with reasonable and feasible alternative plans to address them. They also need a cool website :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-22358179968022866052011-01-28T13:31:32.056-05:002011-01-28T13:31:32.056-05:00Credit is being given young, new teachers for bein...Credit is being given young, new teachers for being more effective, enthusiastic, smarter, more caring and concerned. The public has seen "Waiting for Superman" portraying public school teachers who have been in the system as being lazy and refusing to work. Hence, the image of the teacher with their feet up on the desk reading a newspaper while the kids had to fend for themselves. In 21 years of teaching in the South Bronx, special education from K-12, I have rarely seen a teacher who is not doing their best. <br /><br />Are they saying that the rigorous system of obtaining a license to teach in New York State is so meaningless that NYS is giving licenses to unqualified individuals? I guess that anyone who has taught more than five years is a dinosaur and needs to move on or out of the system.<br /><br />These new young teachers have no clue how to handle the issues these students in urban areas are dealing with. Coming from families outside of urban areas, most have had routines in place, expectations, and support. Drugs, gangs, teen pregnancies, violence, and death have an impact on the educational success of a student. Every student I have worked with has been negatively affected by most of these issues. Are situations taken into account in the analysis of data? Schools are being closed for failing and the students are shuffled off to another school until that one is deemed failing when the real issues are not being addressed. Who is working with the families helping them solve problems so that the kids who live in these homes can focus on their education? None of the real issues are being addressed and unfortunately, these young teachers don't even know what the real issues are. Education is never in isolation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-39267346962934859732011-01-28T05:42:39.212-05:002011-01-28T05:42:39.212-05:00I agree with Jonathan: you give these people far t...I agree with Jonathan: you give these people far too much slack, and assume good faith where little or none exists. <br /><br />Look at their pedigree: they're both TFA, which is one of the points of the spear of privatizing the schools. Look at their program: it's lifted directly from the ed deformer playbook. Look at their funding (which they are cagey about admitting to): aside from Gates money, they've received financial assistance from hedge fund interests affiliated with Eva Moskowitz's Harlem Success Academy, which has been most aggressively colonizing public resources and real estate in that rapidly gentrifying community (gentrification in which charter schools are having an increasing and unacknowledged part).<br /><br />While some of the teachers affiliating with this group may simply be naive and approaching these issues in good faith, I don't believe the same thing can be said about its founders.<br /><br />Anyway, don't you find that there is a Stepford Wives quality about so many of these TFAers? When listening to them discuss policy matters, there's a robotic quality; it's all talking points uttered in that supercilious, "But we love kids," tone (as if the rest of us who've actually committed our careers the the classroom don't).<br /><br />For these two, the cup of coffee they had in the classroom (not even staying long enough to gain the tenure they claim is too easy to get) is just a pretext intended to give them some credibility when proposing their funders agenda: a transient, powerless, at-will workforce that provides socialization and vocational training for the lower rungs of the service workforce.Michael Fiorillonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-91793614474464089402011-01-27T21:05:53.580-05:002011-01-27T21:05:53.580-05:00Brilliant Analysis R.E.Brilliant Analysis R.E.CA Teachernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-86637757586851214082011-01-27T20:34:25.162-05:002011-01-27T20:34:25.162-05:00Jonathan: I have to respectfully disagree. At 24 a...Jonathan: I have to respectfully disagree. At 24 and 25 I think it's very easy to misinterpret what's happening with public schools and logical solutions to our problems. The tragedy will be that these kids leave the classroom having not seen any other environments and hold onto their misinformed interpretations for the remainder of their careers outside the classroom. I think it's important to engage people like this openly and honestly. If you go to far and refuse to consider what they have to say, they'll do the same to you. There's a good chance they'll remember those experiences and use them to easily write off people who speak from reality's perspective in the future.<br /><br />I, and so many other young educators, believed exactly what they believed when I started out. I moved to different systems, tried new things, took a semester off to research ed policy, and I've finally come to a very different conclusion than when I started. Had I not done that, I may very well be a member of E4E today. I will grant that truth may not be their priority, but I think it's worth having the conversation just in case it is.james boutinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09625944306253098621noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-36167875715445462202011-01-27T18:09:55.072-05:002011-01-27T18:09:55.072-05:00Thank you for this post. It should be required rea...Thank you for this post. It should be required reading for all teachers. I’m afraid that many teachers are too busy working very very hard (you know educating kids!) and do not understand the organized, well funded, and media savvy assault that is now being waged against public education. Every day as I enter my school I pass a big banner that congratulates the school for some award from the Broad Foundation. When that sign went up a few years ago, I had never heard of the Broad Foundation. I had no idea that this foundation was actively seeking to apply neo-liberal market-based approaches to the education system in the US. I had no idea that this foundation was part of the corporate reformers that are out to distroy public education. <br /><br />I think it is time for us to come together, educate our fellow teachers, and push back. I don’t think that the UFT is doing this so I think it is time for our own new organization. We, of course, will not have the deep pockets that the E4E guys enjoy, but we could have real educators who could explain to people what is happening and the damage that these educational entrepreneurs will have on public education. I am looking to join up with like-minded teachers who are interested in countering the CRM’s attack. <br /><br />As far as the E4E guys go, well they are careerish. I was a Teaching Fellow so you know I was in *business* before I became a teacher. I’m all hip and stuff too. I understand where these guys are coming from. They were in a classroom in NYC and now they are gonna (leverage) use their experience and make it big. They missed the dot com bubble and the housing bubble so you can’t blame them for getting in on the education bubble. We all know that bubbles don’t last and we all know that the investors, foundations, corporate board memberships, book deals and oh… maybe a movie (think that facebook movie but with the two E4E guys) well they all go away when the bubble bursts.Donnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-50714385826714149752011-01-27T17:30:13.537-05:002011-01-27T17:30:13.537-05:00What I don't get is why these people didn'...What I don't get is why these people didn't stay teachers if they wanted to make a difference in education so badly. It's always those who are NOT teachers calling for all this stuff. As you said "snake oil salesmen".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-74330387501407000772011-01-27T16:20:05.331-05:002011-01-27T16:20:05.331-05:00I don't assume good faith. This project is TfA...I don't assume good faith. This project is TfA initiated, and TfAers leave in 2 or 3 years anyhow. <br /><br />There's no immediate self-interest from these former teachers, or from most of the members. They are in it for the policy war. They are ideologically committed. And they are using their temporary teaching careers as a credential.<br /><br />JonathanAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-79735537755724012152011-01-27T15:46:17.425-05:002011-01-27T15:46:17.425-05:00TFA people shouldn't even be called teachers. ...TFA people shouldn't even be called teachers. They should be called education temps.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5113479300897983388.post-21488525560930458482011-01-27T15:39:18.013-05:002011-01-27T15:39:18.013-05:00That's pretty much my reaction -- if their pol...That's pretty much my reaction -- if their policies were implemented and they worked, we'd have to spend a lot more on education, which is not the plan of their allies.<br /><br />Also these kids don't understand that in the real world, after you collaborate with administration over a period of several years on some kind of cool evaluation system or something, what happens next is that a new administration comes in and imposes whatever the education flavor of the month is and might just send you to Siberia for perpetuating the status quo if you insist on advocating for the cool evaluation system you helped cook up.Tom Hoffmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08577165613934129833noreply@blogger.com